Judges 2017

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Re: Judges 2017

Post  jingle on Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:43 am

B4p wrote:

Why do Alexandra and Debbie never get any constructive or negative feedback from the judges? Have they got Strictly immunity or something?
Why is Spatchcock still praised beyond compare, even when for the first time ever, she's been placed halfway down the scoreboard?
Why, when Gemma loses a shoe on a fleckerl she's crucified, but when Budgie hops and wobbles, with no real latin hip action or rhythm, the judges all stay quiet and go judge-blind.

Good rant B4P, have to agree. When I rewatched the show I did notice a lot of Budgie wobbles, as well as her trademark clipped and overly neat footwork/lack of hips. The latin dances are definitely a weakness for her, but the judges won't come out and say it.
Agree with you about Jonnie, the comments were unnecessarily cruel and lacked understanding. Though to be fair, at least most of them did all counter it with a positive, eg about improved frame or good synchronicity.
Why do they never comment on Davood's face-freeze and the catching-flies mouth? Or his skipping?
Why do they not give credit where it's due - for example they've been hammering on about Mollie's core for weeks....the flying lifts that she did last night needed core strength to retain the position (something they'd previously praised Budgie for) yet there was no recognition of that.

Something not quite right about the judges comments and scores this year Evil or Very Mad
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  B4p on Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:12 am

CaledonianCraig wrote: I do realize the judges round on weaknesses when they see the dancer as the weakest left in the contest. Heck Ann Widdecombe got it for her size as have others in the past. It is their way of getting across they think that the celebs time to go has come.

When Jonnie agreed to take part in the show his disability was not an issue and I don't see that it is now. I just think that he has gone as far as he can and his time to go is now. No disgrace given we are at the halfway mark.
I don't have a problem with anyone thinking it's time for any of the contestants to go home. What I cannot tolerate, in any shape or form, is any comment based on disability, size, gender, sexual orientation etc etc. In this day and age, any form of discrimination, (particularly cheap shots like last night) should be stamped out. The BBC has some responsibility to be seen to lead the way, not perpetuating outdated stereotypes.

I think out of last night's show Susan was certainly the weakest. Not a coincidence that Peter Kay was on Friday's ITT drumming up support for her, or appearing again sounding drunk as a skunk in the Clauditorium last night.
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  CaledonianCraig on Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:54 am

I dont see that it is discrimination though. They are criticizing his posture which is awful. It wasn't so bad at the start so I don't see that it is purely down to the prosthetic. Any weaknesses in technique and the judges will highlight it. It has always been that way and always will no doubt. I have no doubts each judge has their own favourites as well as will always be the case.

As I said my theory about his deteriorating posture is that the pressure is on. Jonnie knows he needs to find more and is putting in more physical effort in the process and that is impacting on his posture.
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  B4p on Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:08 pm

CaledonianCraig wrote:I dont see that it is discrimination though. They are criticizing his posture which is awful. It wasn't so bad at the start so I don't see that it is purely down to the prosthetic.
I agree his posture is awful. I agree it's not purely down to the prosthetic. My point is, in order for him to propel forward, he cannot stand up straight or balance as well as the others, unless he sticks his bum out. 'Stompy footwork' isn't for the same reason for Jonnie, as it is for the other contestants. Some things are out of his control.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  TANGOLERO on Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:25 pm

B4p wrote:

I don't have a problem with anyone thinking it's time for any of the contestants to go home. What I cannot tolerate, in any shape or form, is any comment based on disability, size, gender, sexual orientation etc etc. In this day and age, any form of discrimination, (particularly cheap shots like last night) should be stamped out. The BBC has some responsibility to be seen to lead the way, not perpetuating outdated stereotypes. I think out of last night's show Susan was certainly the weakest. Not a coincidence that Peter Kay was on Friday's ITT drumming up support for her, or appearing again sounding drunk as a skunk in the Clauditorium last night.

Sunday rant comin up: Have to address this B4p, because if nothing else, I'm honest, so here goes. Is the above not a cheap shot at P.K? Of course it is, because it's what you think, but it isn't exactly complimentary. Discrimination of any sort is a part of life and always will be, and I actually hate perfect people because there are no such animals. I've made jokes about all sorts of people but never designed to offend (except the outraged element) and don't care who makes comment about me, why should I? It would be between me and them to address should I feel the need. I hate false outrage and am very guilty of having a good old rant occasionally because I'm just human (I think). Who the hell really cares? There's a vast difference between what we say out loud and do, and what we actually think that makes every one of a natural hypoctite and, in some cases, blatant liars. It's why there can't be a level playing field in anything because we're all different. Women like Susan can't hope to compete with Bugie or the Queen of Gush (there I go discriminating) because of pure physical difference. Take her to a dance school and teach her basics and she could win a gold medal, but this isn't a dance class where things are level and fair and never can be unless the contestants have to be between certain ages and be able to fit through a Brussells Strictlyometer template. Even Jonni has to be at a severe disadvantage against the rest because of his disability, but it doesn't stop the producers roping either in for "entertain ment" sake and viewer ratings, just like they did with John Sargent, old and tubby, Anne Widdicombe, older and just as tubby, Russell Grant etc . Everybody loves Jonni for what he's achieved already in life, but although I might paso around the sitting room to a Spanish record, there's nothing for An ton and co to get concerned about, I'll trip over something shortly and get laughed at. In other words, the playing field isn't level at all. My wife gets a certain red-top comic because she prefers the crosswords etc, and it's the outrage journal always ready to denounce somebody for winking at a girl back in 1970 or screw another happy marriage up with a "disclosure" of infidelity.(I actually laugh my walnuts off at such blatant hypocracy) Am I entitled then to write up and tell them (even contact @.Twitterbrain) and complain at being pestered on about fourteen different pages of their rag by women with everything and its freckles hanging out of suspenders and bikinis while I'm having breakfast? (I won't mention T,V of course).

Sorry, but it's all got out of hand and humour will soon be a total sin. That'll be the time for me to stop bothering cleaning my false teeth, stop caring about my dodgy knee and be very thankful I still have some hair left to comb and shave (awful price razor-blades today) and a face to laugh at in the mirror. I don't feel outraged at any of these things, or that I can't beat Michael Van Gerwin at darts. It's just the way the cookie (no, that's American, let's say rich tea biscuit) crumbles. On with it.

Please don't be offended. I'm quite nice really... Laughing
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  B4p on Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:27 pm

TANGOLERO wrote: It's why there can't be a level playing field in anything because we're all different. ..... but it doesn't stop the producers roping either in for "entertainment" sake and viewer ratings, just like they did with John Sargent, old and tubby, Anne Widdicombe, older and just as tubby, Russell Grant etc . Please don't be offended. I'm quite nice really... Laughing
I'm not offended Tango. I don't profess to be perfect. I do however have a close friend with similar balance problems to Jonnie, so disability is something I'm passionate about.

You're right about my cheap shot at PK, but his state of sobriety is after all his choice.

I appreciate Strictly's never going to be a level playing field. I realise that all the contestants sign up for the good, bad, and sometimes downright ugly comments too. I understand that the producers rope a few in each year purely for entertainment value.

What I cannot stand, (and I appreciate it is only my opinion) is judges making unhelpful comments that are outside any of the contestants capabilities.
Davood's posture is pretty awful, but he's slowly fixing it. The judges don't mention his gaping mouth.
Alexandra's pigeon toes are still a problem, but she's been working on them. The judges don't mention her shoulders being worn as earings.
Mollie's core has strengthened no end over the last few weeks. The judges haven't mentioned it.
Debbies latin hip action is dire, but it's fixable. Her foot work is often overlooked by the judges.
Susan is light of foot, but the height difference, and her weight issues are not so easily fixed, and not mentioned by the judges.

My point is, Jonnie wouldn't be able to correct some of the weekly criticisms the judges give him. Four judges onto 1 is just a Gladatorial food fest. Ruth, Mollie & Davood have all been mauled in a similar fashion recently. For me, that's not my idea of entertainment.

Just my opinions (and I also agree that opinions are not facts).
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  saxonsiren on Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:27 pm

I agree B4p just went to far... compromise judges re individuals their abilities or disability. Think outside the box for once about bums and posture.....
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  fiftynotout on Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:26 am

I can’t speak for Jonnie but I do remember his comment when voted off when he thanked the judges for judging him “as an equal”. That suggests to me that he wanted the feedback, good or bad, and was grateful that no concessions were given because of his disability. They are all disabled to some extent - whether by age, size, height - and since the nature of the competition is NOT to start with a level playing field they must surely know what to expect by now.

Although I do really wish somebody would mention Davood’s mouth. I know nothing about the man, never seen him before in my life, but will always think of him as totally gormless (which I’m sure he isn’t).
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  saxonsiren on Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:32 am

Hiya fitftynotout I agree re washing machine cycle mouth Davood. He seems to gun a lot too... I've got used to it now and have enjoyed his dancing save the Moor display....

I know Jonnie wanted to be treated the same however judges could have changed the record re bum etc let's face it Jonnie could not have pointed both feet etc so why bang on about it? Critique other areas, head,arms etc just mute about bum/central posture a bit
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  Tappingfeet on Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:43 am

saxonsiren wrote:Hiya  fitftynotout  I agree re washing machine cycle mouth Davood. He seems to gun a lot too... I've got used to it now and have enjoyed his dancing save the Moor display....

I know Jonnie wanted to be treated the same however judges could have changed the record re bum etc let's face it Jonnie could not have pointed both feet etc so why bang on about it? Critique other areas, head,arms etc just mute about bum/central posture a bit

I have to agree re Jonnies bum .They saw it and knew why and so what was the point in whinging about it .I am guessing Susan would look more elegant with longer legs but it would be pointless to harp on about it too .
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Re: Judges 2017

Post  B4p on Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:51 pm

Well, the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse seem to have ridden into the sunset, sucking their acid drops en route. affraid

I much preferred this week's show. I thought the judges were far more constructive in their critiques. Much more comfortable viewing.

I also loved, the judges being included in the 'Fashion' catwalk, although Cr aig darrrrling, you looked like you were dragging a sack of coal behind you! A bit
stomp-tastic.
Br uno and An ton rocked it. Loved the contestants, and some of the Pros wearing their shades, being part of the runway audience.

Well done everybody. Consider yourselves redeemed Laughing
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